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  • 枫下沙龙 / 谈天说地 / 看看加拿大移民部长这个弱智
    本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛仅举两例
    1.既然你要'best, brightest'的来加拿大,为什么不好好善待他们,又让他们去了美国呢? 为什么又要吸收40%的家庭移民和难民呢?难道他们比技术移民更"better, brighter"?
    2."I don't agree with the lawyers that say 95 per cent will not qualify. That's not the information I have from the department. We believe that similar numbers that qualify now will qualify under the new system,''
    我真怀疑这位部长是不是看过新的移民法,如果按新的移民法,真不知道已经在加拿大的永久居民中有没有5%可以达到80分.
    没有offer,10分没了,如果英语不是fluent,一下子就费了,更别提你很难拿到10分的适应分了.

    本来觉着干计算机这一行工资这么高,以后老了怎么办?后来突然想通了,扫马路的,开TTC的,学校的老师工资都不比我低,连这种弱智都当上了部长,我还愁啥,加拿大真好!


    Caplan defends 'best, brightest' immigration rules
    `We must do what's best for Canada'
    Allan Thompson
    OTTAWA BUREAU
    Advertisement:
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    RENE JOHNSTON/ TORONTO STAR
    PAPERWORK: Refugee Ginanasegaram Muruguppillai fills out Canadian immigration forms in Buffalo, N. Y.


    BORDER PROBLEMS: Critics of Canada's immigration system such as Roslyn Kunin, left, have put Elinor Caplan on the defensive.
    OTTAWA ?Canada is changing its immigration policies to encourage the world's "best and the brightest" to come here, Immigration Minister Elinor Caplan says.

    Caplan also said yesterday many critics of the federal government's plans to make it harder to enter Canada are lawyers from "the immigration industry," who are more concerned about their clients than Canada's changing needs in the 21st century.

    "They are concerned about their clients' interests and I'm concerned about the Canadian public interest. The new point system and the approach that we've taken is in Canada's interest," she said in an interview.

    "Bringing the best and the brightest is in Canada's interest. We are competing with the rest of the world for those people," she said.

    Defiant in the face of a torrent of criticism, Caplan defended her plan to make it more difficult to enter Canada as an independent immigrant and to apply the new rules retroactively.

    But she said her goal is not to reduce the number of immigrants ?her objective is still to move toward setting immigration at 1 per cent of the population, or about 300,000 a year.

    The new point system puts much more emphasis on education, language skills, work experience and ties to Canada, such as having family or a job offer. It eliminates the old practise of points for certain occupations.

    Under the changes announced Monday, hundreds of thousands of immigration applicants could find themselves disqualified. The new regulations may disqualify some applicants who might have made it under the old rules.

    Lawyers have denounced the changes, charging they make it dramatically harder for legitimate applicants to be accepted as immigrants.

    In the interview with The Star, Caplan said some of the mythology about the hard-working, blue collar immigrants who built this country is a thing of the past, and it's time to raise the threshold to attract the world's best. She said there must be a shift in thinking about the kind of immigrants Canada needs to attract.

    "Part of that is mythology of a different time. At the time when we populated the West we needed people to till the land and open the West. Right now, we know that the economic competitive advantage for Canada is that we have a knowledge-based economy here. We are looking to bring people here that will integrate and succeed quickly," she said.

    Even though the new rules will be applied when they come into effect next June to hundreds of thousands of cases already in the system ?with a compromise bonus of five points for those who filed applications before Dec. 17 ?Caplan insisted she doesn't see the move as retroactive.

    She said the proposed changes have been in the public domain for so long that applicants and their lawyers had fair warning new rules were coming.

    "Because we've given such advance notice on this, I don't consider it retroactive at all," she said. "I think that's fair and very reasonable."

    The main issue is the new point system for independent immigrants and the fact the grid will be applied to many files already in the system.

    The Canadian Bar Association and a number of prominent immigration lawyers have slammed the proposed changes. Critics insist it is grossly unfair to change the rules midstream and swallow the processing fees paid by applicants who would have qualified under the old grid and will now lose out. (Adults pay $500 each in a non-refundable processing fee and $100 for each dependent child).

    Critics also contend the immigration department is setting the bar so high it will exclude most blue collar workers and even eliminate many university-educated and experienced applicants from the skilled trades.

    "I have 34 years of experience, I've seen three Immigration Acts and I've never seen anything like this, it is beyond belief, the situation is nuts," said immigration lawyer Gary Segal, author of a leading guide to Canada's immigration policy.

    It is important to distinguish between immigrants and refugees. Refugees, who come here seeking protection because they fear persecution, are put through a separate screening process.

    Immigrants who come here to live, fall into two broad categories: Independent immigrants who are selected for their skills according to a point system (about 60 per cent of immigrants) and family-class immigrants who are sponsored by family members already living here and who don't have to go through the point grid to get in (about 40 per cent).

    Under the new system, the pass mark will be 80 points out of 100, up from 70 out of 110 in the old system.

    In the past, when major changes in immigration rules have been brought in, prospective immigrants who already had applications in the system had their files processed under the old regulations. Not so this time.

    "I don't agree with the lawyers that say 95 per cent will not qualify. That's not the information I have from the department. We believe that similar numbers that qualify now will qualify under the new system,'' Caplan said. "Many people who before wouldn't qualify will, and there will be some who won't, but it will balance itself out."

    Caplan said Canada's immigration program still brings in tens of thousands of family-class immigrants and refugees, who make up about 40 per cent of newcomers.

    The independent immigrant program needs to be more selective, she said, adding a beefed up temporary worker program ?rather than the independent immigrant stream ?will become a major avenue for workers in the skilled trades to enter Canada.

    Once in Canada and working, they could apply later to stay permanently, if they qualify under the point system. There is also an immigration stream that allows provinces to nominate immigrants to come to Canada to meet a labour shortage.

    "So are we going to meet labour shortages, yes, but we're going to do it in a different way," she said.

    Caplan said she is open to some debate: "This pass mark is not carved in stone. If you want to debate whether 80 is too high or not, that's what this consultation is all about."

    But she made clear that she is inclined to try the 80 pass mark on for size and only lower the threshold if it ends up reducing immigration levels.

    "We've got 500,000 applications in the system now...so part of that is inventory management," she said. "That's what I call managing the inventory in a way which meets Canada's interests. And that may not always meet the interests of the immigration industry. I understand that. But my job is to do what I think is in Canada's best interest."更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
    • 我说两句
      本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛仅举两例
      1.既然你要'best, brightest'的来加拿大,为什么不好好善待他们,又让他们去了美国呢? 为什么又要吸收40%的家庭移民和难民呢?难道他们比技术移民更"better, brighter"?

      你理解的“好好善待” 是什么?分配个工作,附带几室几厅的住房,配偶”农转非“,包子女入托入学? 如果连家庭移民都不接受的国家,你又指望能吸引什么样的人?而且,难道家庭移民和难民就不比那些找不到工作、一天到晚报怨被加拿大骗来了的技术移民更"better, brighter"?


      2."I don't agree with the lawyers that say 95 per cent will not qualify. That's not the information I have from the department. We believe that similar numbers that qualify now will qualify under the new system,''
      我真怀疑这位部长是不是看过新的移民法,如果按新的移民法,真不知道已经在加拿大的永久居民中有没有5%可以达到80分.
      没有offer,10分没了,如果英语不是fluent,一下子就费了,更别提你很难拿到10分的适应分了.

      来自中国的新移民可能没有5%可以达到80分。但别的国家呢?话说回来,如果英语不是fluent, 来当学生还凑合,要找好工作,祈祷吧。


      本来觉着干计算机这一行工资这么高,以后老了怎么办?后来突然想通了,扫马路的,开TTC的,学校的老师工资都不比我低,连这种弱智都当上了部长,我还愁啥,加拿大真好!

      我在移民加拿大的NEWSGROUP上曾读到一句话:有人移民加拿大是因为他们热爱加拿大;而有人移加是因为他们想离开原来的居住国,而加拿大又容易移民。更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
      • 跑题!但可以从新移民法中看出他们也很为难:不要移民经济就不行;来了移民又没人留下来!
        • 所以我们这些已经landing的移民也要警惕。这次可以修改移民法提高达标分数,以后也可以修改公民和国籍法延长入籍居住年限,并且同样有可能回溯执行!最好能促成一次集体诉讼,即使最后不成功,也可以让他们不敢再这样有恃无恐!
          • 说得好,全体在加拿大的技术移民来一个集体示威游行是否合理和合法?第一个修正案通过就可能来下一个,全体技术移民要注意了
        • 来自别的国家的新移民是不是登陆之后或拿到公民后就打算“回国发展”呢?非技术移民呢?
      • 有理. 但在下热爱加拿大是因为有了美国作比较. 不过虽然老移民对此很有同感, 在新移民中不太有市常. 只有新移民变老移民后才有体会.
        • 严重同意。
        • Why canada is better than america? I am a new comer, so i want to know why so many people do not want to go to USA after they settled down.
          • Just a few thoughts I have
            - We don't have to worry about too much about what happened between US and China one day. True, Canadaian Governemnt follows most of states policy. But it is much more gentle. 911 is a good example
            - I think Canadian people are great peopple. It must be really tough to build a country like this so north in a few hundred years. A lot of people died when they first settled here.
            - After landing, I was able to get student loan to study something I like and establish myself here. I really appreciate it.
            - I went to states a few times. I think life in most part of states is similar to here except for big cities and north California. However, I can't imagine have a life in San Jose. Just a personal choice.
            ...
            Kind of hard to say. It's like if anyone staying in one place long enough, he/she is going to love there.
          • 美加之比较,是个见仁见智没完没了的话题。
            有一点我想说,在未来的三五十年内,中美冲突的可能性很大,到时候即使你是美国公民,夹在中间也很难受。虽然不太会象二战时那样进集中营,但一纸法令禁止华人从事高科技,就把你的饭碗砸了。
            你当然可以回国发展,但被当作间谍的机会大增。
            • 耸人听闻!
          • 这问题太难. 不过说美国好的说来说去只有一个字: 钱. 你在北美待久了就知道生活中比钱更重要的实在太多了.
    • 政府精着呢.
      1. 美国经济现在比加拿大差, 去美国的人纷纷回加拿大, 现在谁还往美国跑? 不信你自己往美国发一千份RESUME试试, 看看有谁要INTERVIEW你.

      2. 新的移民数目肯定用得完. 美国有几十万H1B正在那里提心掉胆, 新移民法来的正是时候.
      • H1B以及H1B下岗的主要是IT人士, 加拿大也吃不下那么多
        • 美国拿H1-B的IT人士或其他高科技人士一般都有硕士学位,三四年以上的工作经验,英语也不错,最后新移民法符合条件的肯定是他们,大陆直接申请 的是没戏了,加拿大的大门从此对大陆关闭了。
          • 多数留学生也没有4年经验和加拿大亲戚.
            • 留学生的RA也可以算工作经验。H1B中还很有一些有国内硕士、博士学位和工作经验,到美国工作的,绿卡、PR同时申请。
              • RA, TA不是FULLTIME
                • 工作经验非要FULLTIME的才算吗?
                  • 是的
                • 新移民法强调当学生不挣工资的CO-OP也算工作经验,劳工来加拿大的细则 另行制定。劳工持工作签证来加工作几年后也可按照新移民法申请移民。
              • 其实说来说去加拿大最缺的是技术工人,这些留学生能解决什么问题?加拿大现在自己学校毕业的研究生,本科生找工作都有困难.
      • you are right, I forget the H1 holders in US, maybe the new law is prepared for them.
        • 还有就是对印度和其他英语国家的移民也略有利. 可能印度生活水平低, 他们移到美加后从来没有报怨的. 至于难民就更应该接受, 因为这些人不但不报怨而且吃得了苦, 工作更勤奋.
        • 高!实在是高!
    • 其实政府有权利改变移民法,以利于自己的国家,肯定是要那些对自己有好处的人才。但现在正在申请的人也要用新法的标准,就有一点流氓的味道了。
      • 对,这点最无耻!要是改个乳剂法,我们这班400天左右就脱离苦海的弟选还不知道怎么发愁呢!
      • 比比其他西方国家加拿大已经是非常客气了.